help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

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PM T2
Posts: 184
Joined: Mon May 30, 2016 10:06 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby PM T2 » Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:21 pm

the "B" is simply the model designation used by Lockwood for (at the very least) the 1930 model year, and typically signifies that you have a Silent Chief.

For what its worth, I also believe that the "B" designation on the rope sheave was used in 1929. The published model-year guides all say that the 1929 service Chief motors were 92B's, but the rope sheaves don't necessarily indicate that. By the same token, there's no rope sheave numbers on the racer that ID it as a 92BR.

For the life of me, I cannot recall ever seeing a Chief rope sheave stamped as "92B". Lots of 92A aces, but no 92B Chiefs. Now as soon as I print that, it's likely that I'll will get bombarded with several dozen pictures of Chief rope sheaves stamped that way, but what I do know for sure is that none of my Chiefs are ID'd on the rope sheave in that manner. One of them is a 1929 motor, and only has a "B" stamped for model designation.

Hope this helps.

Best,
PM T2

Joe1
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2017 5:56 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby Joe1 » Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:40 pm

Thanks .so on the 29 Service Chief the only different is Flywheel and dual carbs an where all 14 hp .race motor or not. joe1

PM T2
Posts: 184
Joined: Mon May 30, 2016 10:06 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby PM T2 » Mon Jul 10, 2017 10:28 pm

Not as simple as just flywheel and carbs.

Main differences between the BR and the B are;

Externally - BR used different flywheel and magneto, dual carbs with progressive linkage, drip oilers, cylindrical gas tank, and choice of propeller

Internally - BR used two-ring pistons with aluminum rods, the crankshaft is drilled for better oiling, and I'd leave it up to Jim Ross to tell me whether the racing crank had bigger journals for the upper & lower bearings or not.

While I'm thinking about it - what prop(s) do you have on your motors? They are ID'd with letters and numbers on the prop hub.

Standard prop is usually 9 inch diameter X 14 pitch

Racing prop normally at least 15 pitch and I have seen one marked as a 16 p.

Brief synopsis of Chief HP ratings - some books show the service motor rated at 14 HP, but 11 is more realistic.

14-plus horsepower rating should only apply to the BR. Unless they actually dyno'd motors, I doubt they knew for sure if it was putting out more than 14 HP or not

In 1931 the service Chief was sold only to Montgomery-ward to be re-labeled as a model 500 Sea King. These motors were given a very generous 15 HP rating, even though it was the same motor as the 11 HP service model B. All model 500's marketed in 1931-32 were rated at 15 HP

in 1933 the NOA rating system was implemented, resulting in a downgrade of the model 500 Sea King from the advertised 15 HP to a more honest 11 HP.

Hope this helps.

Joe1
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2017 5:56 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby Joe1 » Tue Jul 11, 2017 12:33 am

9×14. P's .so now u got me Confused if raceing an the cheif have the same bore 2.375" raceing 2 rings an cheif 1 .my piston's stamped 094 ' 060 2rings joe1

PM T2
Posts: 184
Joined: Mon May 30, 2016 10:06 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby PM T2 » Tue Jul 11, 2017 6:38 am

Who said anything about a 1 ring piston? Nobody in this string that I could see.

9 X 14 is the PROP SPEC. Nothing to do with cylinder bore or number of rings.

2.375" is the STOCK BORE!

the .060 merely reflects that the cylinders apparently have been bored out to accept larger diameter pistons. As Jim Ross pointed out, 0.60" is the largest overbore that would have been permitted in order to maintain the B-class rating.

Best,
PM T2

rickrodt
1st Vice President AOMCI
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Location: Indianapolis, In

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby rickrodt » Tue Jul 11, 2017 10:41 am

With regards to the crankshafts with or without the oiling passages, right now I have 4 cranks on my workbench. I am building up a Model 500 Sea King (Lockwood Chief) motor. Two of the cranks have the holes in the rod journals and two do not. I bought one crank from Doug Penn and I think this is from an early Chief. It is my opinion that during the production of Lockwood Chiefs, they discovered the benefit of the oiling holes in the crank and put them in the later or last of the production Chiefs, my Sea King being one of them. Like the automotive industry, the outboards learned much from racing and it is my opinion that the BR motors might have been the first to have these passages in the cranks. The Lockwood engineers discovered the benefits and then moved the passages into the production line.

On my Model 500 Sea King, it came to me with a Lockwood Ace crank, mag plate and flywheel installed on it. The BR's also had the same parts on them. 1930 was the last year of the Lockwood outboards. OMC had just purchased the company and decided to close out the brand. Remember this was at the beginning of the Great Depression and money was tight so OMC decided to reduce down their inventory by selling outboards to Montgomery Wards. It is my opinion that OMC assembled as many motors they could and sold them where they could to bring in capital to keep OMC afloat. My motor has the 3 ring pistons and the bronze rods.

Rick

Joe1
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2017 5:56 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby Joe1 » Tue Jul 11, 2017 12:08 pm

Sorry I was posting 9x 14 p as to what Props I had as to T2 was asking me what props I had on my Motors sorry about not clarifying as 2 one ring on here i Thought one ring was Service Chief an two rings for racing chief This is what I thought from what I've read.the other post I had on here T2 said he had never seen a 2 ring on a raceing motor but was told they Exist so that's y i was saying mine where 2 .other post ( Help Lockwood cheif 1928' 30 ) thanks joe1 just trying to Learn as much as I can on these motors as my hobby was always model A cars just started boat motor's I like the Idea or keeping it in the living room when it's done ha ha ha ha ha can't do that with car

rickrodt
1st Vice President AOMCI
Posts: 136
Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 3:30 pm
Location: Indianapolis, In

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby rickrodt » Tue Jul 11, 2017 2:20 pm

On my motor, it has two piston rings at the top of the piston and one ring down at the bottom of the skirt for a total of 3 piston rings.

Rick

Joe1
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2017 5:56 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby Joe1 » Tue Jul 11, 2017 6:47 pm

Now that was thinking 3 ring stops piston slapping .joe 1

Joe1
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2017 5:56 pm

Re: help ID a crank Lockwood racing motor is this a 094 crank stock

Postby Joe1 » Fri Jul 14, 2017 3:54 pm

Rick u Said you had 4 crankshafts are all the key ways for the flywheel cut in the same location as I read the timeing was different on the raceing motor's u don't have a cam so the only way that I can see is to Change the timing is by moving the key way joe1


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