Sea King Ran, Then Doesn’t Need Help Please

[John Gragg]

So as I related in a post last week (titled “It’s Alive”) the ’49 Sea King made some really good noise last week. I could not run it because I had no lower on it but it did start and run until I shut it off twice. (Only 2 seconds each time) Yesterday I put the lower together and I tried again today. Lots of pops, it tried to start once or twice but no dice. Had all the setting as before.

Need advice.  Compression when I purchased was 62 and 65 (I think, don’t quite remember). Checked again today, same thing. Added oil to each cylinder and got 88 and 90. So rings, right?

I’m assuming the solid starts last week were a result of heated rings from turning the motor over, no?

Should this motor run with the 60 psi or am I dreaming?

What are my options to getting my compression up? Unless I’m missing something no need to even worry about reeds, etc as it’s pretty clear the rings are weak, right?

When I did the carb I was very careful with the reeds and made sure they were well seated. They were in really good shape, but the outer covers needed to be adjusted to hold the actual reeds closed against the flange.

Carb has the tiniest of leaks, (out the top maybe?) but I replaced the cork float (that I thought was working well but wasn’t) with the Sierra 18-7208 float so I’m not sure what thats about.  I admit I have not formally  checked for flooding but since I got more pops after hitting the primer button, pretty sure flooding is not as issue.

Yes, unless someone tells me something else, I’m already assuming I need to pull the powerhead off to check the cylinders for scars, damage, grooves or whatever might be losing compression?

I’ve already searched for pistons/rings. The pistons seem to be available (brand new even),  but I hit a zero on the rings.

HELP!

John Gragg
RIverside, CA

Just starting in the hobby, please be patient.

48 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
49 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
48 Johnson TD20
49 Johnson TD20
54 Johnson QD15
55 Johnson CD12
57 Johnson RJE-19M
57 Johnson RDE-19

[John Gragg]

Talking to myself.  Interesting.

John Gragg
RIverside, CA

Just starting in the hobby, please be patient.

48 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
49 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
48 Johnson TD20
49 Johnson TD20
54 Johnson QD15
55 Johnson CD12
57 Johnson RJE-19M
57 Johnson RDE-19

[seakaye12]

hmmmm….well….if it ran last week with 60 PSI it should run now.  Got spark still?

Is your compression gauge reliable and known to give accurate readings?  A lot of people on these forums talk about the “Harbor Freight” quality of gauges which seem prone to give low readings; especially on small engines.    Maybe you have better compression than you think?

Does it pop when you squirt a bit of pre-mix into the carb?  Spark plug wires are on the correct cylinder?  (This is a 2-Cyl engine?)

[The Boat House]

1. 
   If it ran before you put the lower unit on and now it doesn’t I think the first thing I would be checking is the lower unit to see if it could be binding. Tubs.

 

[John Gragg]

Spark is there and good, 3/8″ on both cylinders.

No binding, checked that.

It’s in my post but to clarify: it “ran” and sounded very solid to me, high rpms, both cylinders firing very well. BUT, I can only call it running in the most technical sense. I did not give it any time to overheat, I shut it down within 2 seconds both times. So maybe it just “burped” some solid cycles and would have quit?

Gauge is not a cheapie, but didn’t cost me $150 either. I trust it for now.

Yes, it pops. Wires on correct plugs. It almost started once, but only once. Lots of ‘almost there’ pops, but never quite lightes up. The whole time I’m trying different advance positions. Full advance was, of course, not good. Just about 1/2 way seemed to be the best.

BTW, I’m using a drill and socket to start. My shoulders could not handle the abuse of the repeated starter rope. LOL

I was more hoping someone had enough experience with these to know if 60 was adequate to get it running or not.

For now I’m going to focus on carburation and the missing link. (Less invasive.)

The adjustment screw was loose in its bore, so maybe the carb was sucking air and running lean. When I pulled the plugs, dry as a bone. Smelled like combustion, but dry. As previously stated, pumping the primer seemed to help make it pop. Going to hang the tank again with an in line shutoff valve. Leaving the carb bowl cover off, going to observe float to check for flooding. It’s a new needle and plastic sierra float, but who knows?

I even used starting fluid and didn’t get much out of it. That one thing is what ruined my yesterday for me. When starting fluid doesn’t light your fire, maybe the fire is out, for good?

Wish me luck, if this doesn’t help I’m gonna dig into the cylinders.

Best Regards,

John Gragg
RIverside, CA

Just starting in the hobby, please be patient.

48 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
49 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
48 Johnson TD20
49 Johnson TD20
54 Johnson QD15
55 Johnson CD12
57 Johnson RJE-19M
57 Johnson RDE-19

[aquasonic]

Going back to the basics:

Fuel

Spark

Air

Compression

It sounds like a fuel supply problem by the way it’s described. With all of the drill assisted cranking, and very little combustion, the sparkplugs should be wet from flooding. Starter fluid is not good for two strokes. Some 16:1 mix in a spray bottle is the better option. Maybe you can take another look at the carburetor, fuel lines, and make sure that there’s good flow coming from the tank.

[jeff-register]

Please don’t use starter fluid, it has no luberication & will hurt it! Check the carb again as I was suprised on my Firestone 7.5hp motor has a “fixed” fuel flow & the adjustment is in thet idle screw adjusts the air flow. Opposite than normal usually. Measure resistance from the spark plug wire to ground also. It should br around 4000 ohms, if open it’s bad. If very high resistance, you may have a arc from running without plug wire connected. It arcs to the mag plate & leaves a pin hole on the coiilbcvering & maybe a carbon arc connection in the secondary winding. A carbon arc connection will read very high resistance. Look on the outside  of the block for wet fuel leakage. Maybe block haves leaking fuel charge.

[frankr]

What does “Pump the primer” mean?  You are supposed to hold the float pin down till it slops over.  The motor needs to be set somewhat near level so that slopped-over fuel runs into the engine and not back out onto your feet.  And the mixture needle valve has to be open far enough, say like 3/4 turn or so.

What is the RPM of that drill you are using?  Too slow???

[John Gragg]

All electrical is 100%, checked and triple checked. Used starter fluid a few times, and only as a test to see if it would wake the motor up. It did not, so I quit. Great idea with the spray bottle of fuel mix.

The float bowl is getting plenty of fuel. I open the fuel shutoff and I can watch the needle rise in the bowl. Because I’m unsure of final settings on the mixture needle, I have not installed the primer arm and actuator. So I was using my finger to ‘pump’ fuel into the carb throat.

The motor is level(ish), slightly canted to the rear so I don’t need a bunch of fuel in the tank.  When it started for me last week the needle was open exactly 3/4 turn.

The drill gets hot quick, so yes the rpms suffered. More on that in a sec.

So…as I said I would, I went thru the carb again. I had a spare I purchased cheap so I used the best of both, including packings. The wobble in the adjustment needle went away, the fuel shutoff had a very tiny leak, which stopped. So yes, it was running very lean.

I primed it and hooked up the drill. It started 2 mins later with 1/2 turn to the adjustment needle and the advance at dead center of the motor. Sounded awesome. But it was not in water, again. I let it run about 6 or 8 seconds, and revved the motor slightly, taking it down to near idle, then back up to about 60% advance. It did not shut off by itself, I shut it off. Viola! She ticks really well. Sounded great!

Took it to the test trash can, but the drill was hot and could not overcome the friction of the water against the prop. It’s a cordless, with a chuck that keeps spitting out the socket extension. I planned on getting video, but didn’t. I will get some tomorrow.

Headed to Lowes tomorrow to buy a corded, locking chuck drill.

So the answers are (for now at least):

Yes, 60psi is adequate for this motor, for now.

No, I don’t need to open up the cylinders right now.

Yes, it was in dire need of carburetor attention.

No, I’m not sure this motor will ever start with just a pull rope, but that’s my goal.

Thank you all for the advice,

Best Regards

John Gragg
RIverside, CA

Just starting in the hobby, please be patient.

48 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
49 Sea King 5hp GG9014A
48 Johnson TD20
49 Johnson TD20
54 Johnson QD15
55 Johnson CD12
57 Johnson RJE-19M
57 Johnson RDE-19

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