Double Lever Manual Shift-Johnson Sea-Master

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208386

    Does anyone have advice on how to keep the levers on a Sea-Master shift box from moving? My throttle lever will creep back to slow. In the past, it would stay put, but now I have to keep my had on it to stay at a consistent speed.

    Thanks for any advice!

    frankr
    frankr


    Replies: 5239
    Topics: 48
    #208392

    Which Ship Master? The ones with square corners and shaped knobs have a friction adjustment knob on the bottom. The real old ones with round knobs didn’t have an adjustment, but they usually were too stiff anyway.

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208398

    Good morning frankr, and thanks for the reply! Mine is the real old one with round knobs in excellent operating condition. I blew the powerhead a few years back on my 1957 Evinrude Big Twin, and I sent it the motor to a member in Maryland to replace the original 1957 powerhead with a 1958 powerhead. When I took the motor off to send to the guy for repair, I disconnected the Throttle and Shit lines from the motor as I had done many times before, and I put the boat in my garage covered and it stayed like that for the two years until I got the motor back. I touched NOTHING on the shit box and I touched nothing on the cables. I simply disconnected the motor, and put the boat away. Unfortunately, my motor repair guy kept the motor for over 2 years. Finally when I got the motor back, I set it on the back of my 15 foot wood boat, hooked up the two cables for the Throttle and Shift, and everything seemed fine. Motor runs great, but the Throttle AND Shit levers are a bit sloppy now and move a bit whereas before I sent the motor to have repaired, both were nice and stiff. Just this weekend, I couldn’t get the motor started! I have an electric push button start. It was trying to start as normal & I ended up having to move the Shit lever up just a tiny bit out of the Neutral position, and when I did, the engine found its “sweet spot” and fired right up. Prior to the motor being sent for repair, When the Shit lever was set to Neutral, it was set to Neutral. When I needed to shift Forward or Reverse, I would use quick motions to move forward/reverse..all operated fine. My point is, I just can’t imagine The issue is coming from the Shift Box..I would think it’s coming from where the cables attached to the motor, and I wanted to check with all of you pros before I start pulling things apart because I know nothing about this stuff! I do have the ELOC 1956-1970 Johnson/Evinrude Repair Manual, but it only covers potential problems when the Shift Lever is too stiff, or if the Throttle Lever won’t go all the way forward, etc…nothing to address sloppy or lose Levers. Thanks so much of any insight!

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    sydinnj

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 153
    Topics: 6
    #208399

    If it was fine before and now giving you problems then I would think that the adjustments are off a bit on the motor. there are places on cables and the motor where adjustments can be made. getting a repair manual would be a big help for you. I have this problem on my daughters boat on getting the gears to work right, turns out someone had cut some of the cable housing off. Good luck

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208400

    If it was fine before and now giving you problems then I would think that the adjustments are off a bit on the motor. there are places on cables and the motor where adjustments can be made. getting a repair manual would be a big help for you. I have this problem on my daughters boat on getting the gears to work right, turns out someone had cut some of the cable housing off. Good luck

    I do have the ELOC 1956-1970 Johnson/Evinrude Repair Manual and my model is the old non-adjustable type. You simply attach the shift cable with the non-adjustable trunion to the Shift Arm on the motor. Same thing with the Throttle cable..there is no adjustment as in the later models. Thanks of any advice!

    frankr
    frankr


    Replies: 5239
    Topics: 48
    #208404

    Well the question becomes, have the cables EVER been replaced? That,is do they have plastic trunion nuts where they attach to the 1/4 turn locks on the motor? Those kind are adjustable whereas the old original cables had non-adjustable brass trunions. If they are the adjustable kind, always adjust the cables to fit the motor, never adjust the motor to fit the cables. the adjustable kind do work much smoother and less friction than the old original kind.

    However, I suspect that is only part of the problem, if at all. An educated guess is the coils are dragging on the flywheel magnets, which often happens when the coils are replaced and not set properly. If they are dragging, the drag will try to move the throttle toward “Slow” position. Considering the age of the motor, your guy may have put in new coils.

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208405

    Amazing you mention new coils! Yes, the guy in Maryland did replace the coils but one of the coils was bad, so I just had NEW coils installed this week from a local guy here in Winchester Tennessee that works on these old motors. Man, I’m getting tired of chasing problems with this motor. I hear all the time how reliable and easy these motors are, but I’m always chasing stuff. So how do I go about getting this fixed? Is it easy to do? Also, how do you explain the Shift Lever needing to be moved up slightly out of neutral to get the motor to start?

    Also, mine are the non-adjustable brass trunions. Thanks so much

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208406

    Also, just as another note, when I’m starting the motor, sometimes I’m getting a visible spark coming from the High Speed dial area…This happens when you push the start button, and the motor is cranking to start..Doesn’t happen all the time, but it’s happening sometimes…you see a spark and hear a “pop” sound…don’t know if this is a problem.

    phil
    phil

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 144
    Topics: 18
    #208412

    They’re “easy” in the sense that ordinary people can work on them with tools they probably already have… Replacing and adjusting the ignition components is one place you might need a new tool.

    Here’s the series of articles that convinced me that even *I* could learn to work on old OMC outboards: http://www.omc-boats.org/maxw.html

    They’re reliable once correctly adjusted, but it does require attention to details, and sometimes head scratching to figure out why something isn’t working, but you’ve found the right place to ask questions!

    http://www.omc-boats.org
    http://www.aerocraft-boats.org

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208416

    Thanks Phil! Should I just take the boat back to the mechanic that replaced the coils recently? Oddly enough, when I did get the motor back from the guy in Maryland, I took the boat out and it ran all day like a charm. during this successful first run, I did notice the Throttle was wanting to move back to slow position on its own, and it had never done that before…I didn’t think too much about it. But by end of the day of running the motor on my way back to the dock, the motor started sputtering, and shaking as if it was starved for fuel. It stopped running and I had to be towed to the dock. The next day at home in my test tank, I started the cold motor, and it started up on the first try. After about 10 minutes of running at idle, it started sputtering and shaking again as if it was starved for fuel, but I a motor won’t run for 10 minutes perfectly then all of a sudden start to have fuel issues, so I figured something was going on as the motor heated up. An old timer told me it was likely a bad coil. As the engine heats up, the coil heats up, & that was causing the sputtering/shaking. Made sense to me.

    When I had the local mechanic here in Winchester Tennessee replace the coils last week, he mentioned the existing coils that the guy in Maryland had replaced when he installed a new powerhead were new aftermarket, but one had a crack in it. So, I’m starting to think that the guy in Maryland installed the new coils incorrectly, which caused one of the coils to go bad and crack, and the brand new coils I’ve just had replaced were installed incorrectly as well, and if I don’t get this fixed soon, the new coils will get broken because they are likely rubbing against the magnets on the flywheel as frankr mentioned in an earlier post….I don’t trust myself to take flywheels off, etc…Does anyone on this board know of any trustworthy old outboard mechanics in the middle/south Tennessee area that can fix this? I’ spent over $1,000.00 to the guy in Maryland to install the new 1958 powerhead, coils, carb rebuild, etc…and now another $400 to the guy here in Winchester that insisted I needed a carb rebuild, an electric fuel pump (I convinced him I didn’t need the electric fuel pump) and of course the new coils and points stuff…Thanks everyone

    frankr
    frankr


    Replies: 5239
    Topics: 48
    #208420

    A quick and dirty way to tell if the coils are dragging is to remove the spark plugs and slowly crank the motor over manually while watching the magneto plate under the flywheel. A bit of wiggle isn’t too alarming,, but if it wants to grab and try to rotate with the flywheel, well there ya go. If they are rubbing, the flywheel has to come off for inspection. Could be anything from coils mal-adjustment to a wobbly armature plate, to a cracked/bent flywheel.

    Note the red-circled burn mark on the coil heels in the picture. Caused by heat from rubbing.

    coils-rubbing

    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by frankrfrankr.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by frankrfrankr.
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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208424

    Thanks Frank! The flywheel sits on top of the coils correct? So in that picture, the flywheel has been removed I assume, and the coils, etc. as shown are what is underneath. Since the flywheel is above the coils, how is the flywheel hitting those spots on the edges? What are those green edges hitting? Still don’t know what I would even try to do if I was to remove the flywheel. Thanks again for the insight!

    frankr
    frankr


    Replies: 5239
    Topics: 48
    #208427

    For the sake of imagination, think of the flywheel as an upside-down cake pan, with magnets inside the side, As it rotates, the magnets pass by the coil laminations, where you see the burn marks. The magnets are not supposed to touch the laminations, only pass by with around 010″ clearance. The coils can slide in or out by loosening the three screws that hold them down.

    Flywheel removal requires a proper puller and reinstallation requires a torque wrench to tighten the nut to 60-65 foot/pounds.

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    danblue


    Replies: 58
    Topics: 7
    #208436

    Thanks Frankr, I’ll remove the spark plugs, and have my dad pull the rope start slowly to see if I notice the flywheel grabbing on the coil ring area..Also, should I be concerned with an occasional spark and “pop” sound coming from the high speed needle/dial area when I’m trying to start the motor? It happens sometimes. Thanks!

    frankr
    frankr


    Replies: 5239
    Topics: 48
    #208447

    That ain’t normal. I don’t know what’s causing that.

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