How many have a KE4 KD4?

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    green-thumbs

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 348
    Topics: 37
    #194375

    Kiekhaefer Mercury 11 cu in 6 hp twin from late 1940s
    A Green tanker, but, under the tank there is a surprise in the form of a fabricated steel bracket to adapt KD4 upper water jacket for use with
    the later type tank ring and tank. It also has KD4 type pistons, rods and
    cylinders. I D tag says KE4. It does have the later cranks shaft and thin reed block of KE4 models. Mercury Parts Manual parts list indicates that it is as Kiekhaefer made it.
    Serial number is within range of initial block of serial numbers.
    Interesting example of Kiekhaefer using up old stock parts inventory
    Waste not, Want not transition model.
    If you have one Please respond.
    Louis

    • This topic was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by Avatargreen-thumbs.
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    49morphew

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 59
    Topics: 10
    #194392

    The KD3 and later KE3 are an example of the same. Power heads are interchangeable

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    billw

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 1106
    Topics: 38
    #194416

    I had a KE4 some years ago. I owned it for a long time. In that time, I am sure I must have had the tank off; but I don’t remember that bracket….nor do I remember what it DID have for a bracket! I know the Mark 7 is very similar to a KE4 but with a water-cooled exhaust manifold. It must have had very similar cylinder water jackets. I wonder how THOSE were adapted to the green tank ring?

    Long live American manufacturing!

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    green-thumbs

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 348
    Topics: 37
    #194434

    As best I can determine, some of the first run KE4 were made using KD4
    parts (upper water jacket, cylinders, pistons and connecting rods) This required an adapter to mate the later tank and ring to the earlier
    water jacket, It does have the later crankshaft and thinner reed block
    This was a very puzzling motor until I noticed the parts manual listed
    two part numbers for upper water jacket, cylinders, pistons and rods.
    The cylinder block will accept the KD4 and KE4 parts…as the photos
    indicate.
    I am curious about how many members have a KE4 with KD4 parts
    made that way at factory. The adapter bracket is easy to spot.
    I would expect serial numbers to be a low end of first run, but, that
    is a guess.
    Louis

    Tubs
    Tubs

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 2722
    Topics: 155
    #194449

    • This reply was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by TubsTubs.
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    kirkp

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 83
    Topics: 5
    #194463

    I’ll have to take a look at my KE4 since you have roused my curiosity. It’s an early model with serial number 234XXX. Good compression numbers and phelon coils as a plus.
    Kirk

    Edit: started looking at my KE4 parts list and think I need to look into the phelon statement a bit. List says early KE4 should be scintilla. 🙁

    • This reply was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by Avatarkirkp.
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    green-thumbs

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 348
    Topics: 37
    #194470

    KE4 Mercury up to serial # 259419 had Bendix Scintilla Magneto
    Serial # 259420 and up KE4 Mercury had Phelon Magneto
    All Mark 7 have Phelon Magneto.
    Per Mercury Parts Manual HOWEVER, either magneto will fit any
    KE4 or Mark 7 without any alteration to powerhead

    Louis

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    jeff-register

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 1154
    Topics: 48
    #194471

    Louis,
    I have a KD4 & a KF3. Waiting to finish my 57 DR. Still have Bendix & Phelon coils.

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    green-thumbs

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 348
    Topics: 37
    #194480

    KD4 usually have Eisemann 72 H magneto although I have a parts posterss for KD4 and KD3 that show a part which appears to be
    adapter to allow use of a Bendix magneto, I have not seen either the
    part or a KD4 with Bendix magneto, but, I have lived a sheltered life.
    KF3 had mostly Bendix magnetos, but, last run had Phelon.
    Several years ago a KF3 powerhead was on ebay and it had the
    Phelon magneto…kind of a rare magneto with unique cam and flywheel
    KD3 could have either Eisemann or Bendix magneto, however, if
    recall rightly that would require a different crankcase casting unless
    the adapter was actually manufactured and used.
    Part No. M 10 147 on KD4 parts poster
    Part No, M 10 148 on KD3 parts poster
    Louis
    KD4 and KD4S were 11 cu in 6hp twins based upon prewar Kiekhaefer
    twins sold under Mercury and Wizard brands. Mercury KD4S was replaced by KE4 later renamed Mark 7. Bore, stroke and displacment
    remained the same but power output increased to 7 1/2hp.
    An unknown number of first production run of KE4 were built with KD4
    type rods,pistons,cylinders and water jackets. They did have the improved reed block and crankshaft as well as a new design tower gear case and water pump assembly.
    A point of interest to me is how common are the KE4 motors made with a mix of KD4 and KE4 components?
    Easy way to tell is does your KE4 have KD4 upper water jacket with a
    fabricated steel adapter to link water jacket to fuel tan ring.
    I would appreciate hearing from other who have hybrid Mercs.
    Louis

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    kirkp

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 83
    Topics: 5
    #194564

    Louis, just wondering if this motor is yours? If so, what is the serial number?

    Went out and looked at my KE4 and it has the standard water cylinder with the cast ears.

    One last question. Did you really mean that you’ve never seen a KD4 with scintilla coils?

    Kirk

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    green-thumbs

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 348
    Topics: 37
    #194585

    I went down and looked at a KD4…powerhead had Bendix Magneto
    so I looked it over carefully and also found the adapter that allowed
    the snout type crankcase to accept Bendix Scintilla magneto plate.
    Phelont too, if need be.
    I stand corrected TWICE
    Photos to follow.

    WD4S with Eisemann 72 H

    KE4 with magneto mounting flange cast as part of crankcase

    KD4 serial # 141483 with separate adapter for Bendix Scintilla

    Mercury service tool for removing Bencix Magnet Rotor
    note 7/16 x 20 fine thread nut to protect threads
    Easier to avoid damage than to repair damaged threads.
    Been there Done That

    Edit 2 The above photos are not of the KE4/KD4

    Serial # 141483 does not fall within the serial number ranges
    of KD4 models posted on inside cover of the
    New Parts List for Mercury Models 1939 to 1953

    I am unable to give serial number of KE4/KD4 as I removed
    tank without noting serial number and shelved tank
    with 8 or 9 others. A low end swap meet acquisition
    some years back that required a full tear down due
    to outside storage…ie on junk pile.

    • This reply was modified 6 days, 23 hours ago by Avatargreen-thumbs.
    • This reply was modified 6 days, 23 hours ago by Avatargreen-thumbs.
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    20mercman

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 589
    Topics: 21
    #194653

    I have some of these motors. I have both a 46 & 47 KD-4’s. The 46 has the Eisemann Magneto, and I have not run or restored it yet. The 47 has a Bendix magneto. It was partially rebuilt with new rings and gaskets, coils etc. Not repainted though. It runs good, but not as well as my 47 KE-4. Like Tubs said, you would spend $1000 for a motor that runs this nice and feel like you stole it. I restored mine several years ago, but only went on to run it two years ago. That was a mistake as it is such a sweet little motor. It also has the Bendix magneto. My son Kevin built one from parts from the free pile at Tomahawk two years ago. It has some KD-4 parts in it, but overall it turned out really nice. It also has the Bendix magneto. I have never seen a bracket for the fuel tank like the ones in your photos though.

    Steve

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